We’re designed, manufactured, repaired, and modified by thought, so yes, we can be damaged and broken. But if we couldn’t be damaged and broken, we’d never have a clue as to what we are.
It seems like, I have a different frequency, compared to other members in the group. All I can do is trying to figure out, the ways to tune.
Are you saying that we have to be conditioned, to be hurt, to be damaged in order to be able to see what we are? Is this what you are saying?
Ofcourse you are saying this
But … where do you get it? Have you figured that out?
Is this a reply for me?
Yes, as usual again the conversations are going in multiple directions. I got confused
@Jobuys please prefer the “reply” button on the post you are replying to - rather than the blue reply button at the bottom of the thread.
Also please use the highlight and “quote” function
This will help
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Guys I have a thought
It seems that we should have some understanding of each other before talking. It seems we are people from different cultures, got gathered here.
Thank you for this, Doug.
I also appreciate the other poem you posted. Did you write it?
The tide comes in, the tide goes out,
my toes keep disappearing in the sand.
and someone has just turned on the lights
in the little shack by the dunes.
Thank you for all of these words.
I’ll go out on a limb and say : Yes, my brain spouted the 4 line ditty.
That’s not what I intended to say, but it’s true that having a self-image means being hurt (when not being flattered or patronized).
I’m not saying that the conditioned brain can see what it is doing, because it cannot. It can only see the evidence that it is deceiving itself - not the actual self-deception that it unconsciously, reflexively, practices.
I am fraudulent, fake, an imagined character in my imagined reality, and I am hurt and angry when others see this and let me know. I am hurt when I fail to persuade others that I am who I like to think I am.
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As I said, the evidence shows that I am self-deceiving, pretending to be what I am not, distorting the facts to accord with my beliefs.
Have you figured that out?
There is no figuring anything out - only finding out by acknowledging facts.
For instance, when I react, respond conditionally to something, my conditioned response is a fact I can face directly, or I can justify, condemn, deny, or dismiss because I choose to believe what is true instead of having no choice, i.e, choiceless awareness.
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Plz… let’s go slow on this: so being hurt means you have a self-image.
Where does this self-image come from?
Who or what will tell me that the self is making this image? Is it “being hurt” that tells me this? What is it that is being hurt? Is it different from that what is being hurt? It looks as though it is not, but here thinking might come in action, or better, memory, because i have been told by K f.i. that the thinker and the thought are one.
I am looking into it and i can only hope yhat you might join me in rhis venture.
If you’re seriously “looking into it” you don’t need anyone to join you.
Well, i differ in this.
I am on Kinfonet to go into things together. But … if there is not even an intention to do this, well, you might as well doing it alone.
And then i will ask you: why are you here? Seriously? Only you can tell me this, if you will.
I came here to find out what Krishnamurti meant by certain things he said, some of which I still don’t understand. Perhaps this is not the best place to come to for that purpose. Or, it may be that at a certain point in one’s study of K’s teaching, there is no one who can help the student, and no point in participating in K discussion groups at all.
Thank you for your answer. You say that there are certain things you do not understand fully. I wonder if this is possible at all. Is it uberhaupt possible to understznd someone else? Are we not putting too much trouble in trying to understand K or someone else? I hear K saying that it is only in relationship with another human being, being your beloved ones or a far neighbour or a complete stranger. And not only with human beings , but only nature.
Maybe we might start with nature and go into this relationship, which has been disturbed for so many years.
How do you relate to nature ?
Why not ponder this question and find your own honest answer before you put it to someone else?