So we have a good excuse to not be responsible.
I can feel what you are saying.
When we are in physical pain, we go to doctor. Doctor might do some surgery, give medicine or suggest some lifestyle changes.
When we are in physical pain, words don’t matter. If you have a tooth ache you will go to dentist, not talk intellectually about pain.
Someone who has been involved in exploring K’s teachings is not looking for words, but to find directly. Someone suffering is looking for something directly, not words.
Unfortunately not everyone has the burning need in finding directly. They are satisfied with intellectual exploration, weaving web of words, replacing one word with another and continue on that path. Most seem to be satisfied with that. There are very few serious people who are not satisfied with words only.
Those who are serious, try to explore in daily life and then write here. But there are many not interested in directly finding out in daily life which is not just words.
Why? Is the need less or absent in most people? Is the burning there but unseen, unfelt, hidden from, is being aware of and feeling the burn necessary for ‘finding directly?’ How many of us are willing and able to let the burning in, the suffering, fully, surrender to it?
So when K says you are the world he means your consciousness is the consciousness of the world, sorrow , fear, occasional happiness and so on. He says if one individual changes his consciousness that will effect the consciousness of everybody else around him and in the world .
The next question is , how to bring a change in one’s consciousness.
According to K there is no “how” because every way, method, or technique, takes time, and being silent, empty, and nobody, is timeless.
If you are against my statement why bring K as a defence and make him our authority ? Why not elaborate yourself.
In English language the meaning of the question " how to bring a good society or change in the society is very clear . K shows you how , start from yourself. By understanding your consciousness your consciousness changes. The first step is the last step.
Plus I heard k in his talk say “the how is intelligence”. So all of a sudden condemning the how because k said there is no how to meditate !
I explained why there is no “how” but you thought I was quoting K.
Obviously, one can’t get from here to there by doing what we do here, which is all we know. There is no “how” for the brain that is limited and confined to thought, a time-bound process.
You are saying that everybody is brainwashed (conditioned) and is doomed to be brainwashed till the end of his or her life. If K thought like that he would have not establish all the schools, books , dialogues and so on. The brain has the potential to look into itself and change.That is a fact.
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I can suggest something. You can try for 5 minutes.
Sit quietly, if it helps with closed eyes. Don’t read, listen, have a dialogue. Don’t do anything. Nothing needs to be done as thought.
Your mind will naturally be silent. There is no conflict.
It is the doing that is creating conflict.
The dialogue here, the people here, they are engaged in activity. They cannot give silence, they can only give words and conflict.
No one can teach non-doing, non-conflict, silence.
You might continue dialogue but words won’t provide answer of silence. That is only mental activity.
There is no how in doing something. But in non-doing there is silence.
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Hello Adeen, Excellent suggestion - Thank you - 2 questions come to mind, it might be helpful if we take a look at them :
1)What if the thoughts : “this is boring! I have very important/more interesting things I must do!” come into our heads? Is this not conflict? How do we avoid conflict or fighting our thoughts in this kind of situation?
2)What about people who have been listening to K and think that they must not try to meditate - that trying to meditate defeats the point of “true” meditation? Is it possible to address that conflict/confusion?
Thought does not arise in non-doing as it is passivity, silence, passive awareness, listening. So then how do these words arise? Anything that arises in passivity is only moment to moment, impermanent. If question arises, it also dies. It is silent awareness in which everything is impermanent, not leaving a mark. Only activity, reaction leaves a mark
Yes , that is like a runner who is tired and sits to rest , but soon the confusion of thought comes back.
K is concerned with fundamental change of consciousness which is not gradual.
To bring such a radical transformation one has to know how to observe .One has to know how to listen,and how to live which is true meditation . So the how is very important…
No. That’s your knee-jerk reaction to what I wrote.
What I’ve been saying for years is that we are conditioned to being confined and limited to thought, the prison of self, until/unless interest in self-knowledge subsumes the desire for what should/should-not-be.
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Brainwashed “to being confined and limited to thought to the prison of the self,”
What is worse than that ? Being doomed !?
A major difficulty in letting go comes from identity - if we have a lot to lose, if I am a someone (highly intelligent, well known, well respected, have invested many years in something prrecious, a winner etc) it is harder to die. (and get into heaven)
Precious things include my mind and what I know, and who I am, and what I have created and achieved.
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