Unless the mind is quiet

Unless the mind is quiet, can there be listening, looking? What is happening when the mind isn’t quiet?

I, me, mine…

If the mind is a distraction is it because of thought, or could it be some other manifestation in the brain such as anxiety? What is the state of an anxious mind? Conclusion making, assuming, because it’s not relaxed etc?

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Isn’t thinking behind the ‘anxiety ‘? The ‘gulf’ that thought / time creates between the actual ‘what is’ and a projected future? In that imagined space, the unknown lies? If the brain needs absolute security this kind of ‘occupation ‘ by thought / time robs it of a necessary total tranquility?

The ‘analysis’ above may be right or wrong but what it brings to mind for me is the necessity for an ‘attention’ that includes the observation of an ‘anxious ‘ mind. Beside ‘directed’ attention there is another awareness that is constant. This I think is what K meant by “be attentive to the inattention”. Here there is no effort, no ‘doing’, no ‘choice’. It is an awareness that is not personal. Another “dimension” of awareness? It has no opposite and creates no conflict.

So is it analysis or interpretation or speculation that occurs when the mind is not quiet? What happens when one is attentive to the reaction? Is the falseness seen outside of thought, an insight? If thought sees it, is it not just more of the same?

What “occurs “ is what we see in ourselves and in the world. Minds filled with desire? Anxious and unquiet and ‘trying’ to change that, creates conflict and more anxiety? That is what K was getting at, as I see it, “Change is the denial of change “.

Have you ever been out of your mind? Aren’t these references, not just by you,(there is no gotcha, just asking) but any references by anyone, aren’t these indicative of being in your mind?

Yes of course these are references to something that was said by Krishnamurti…that’s what the K referred to.

Are you “out of your mind” :crazy_face:?

That’s a serious question. Do you take the inquiry seriously? I doubt it.

Rather than asking questions why not say how you feel about something? You asked “have I ever been out of my mind”? If you have, share it. We’re all equal here.

I think everyone has had the experience of being outside of one’s mind, one’s self, momentarily. If that wasn’t the case, no one would take K seriously.

I think we all know at some level that we’re carrying on self-deception because it’s normal, and to be outside of what’s normal, acceptable, respectable, to be alone/all one, is a frightening prospect for the mind than knows only the false sense of security that thought engenders.

Ich schreibe in deutscher sprache !
Ich denke wir sind in der lage zu übersetzten was hier steht ?

<kann ein lauter geist zuhöhren , schauen ?

was passiert wenn der geist nicht still ist ?

Was macht der Geist jetzt ?

I write in German!
I think we are able to translate what is written here?

<can a loud spirit listen, look?

what happens when the mind is not still ?
What is the ghost doing now?

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When memories arise in the mind, if there is a reaction to them of not wanting them to be present, that resistance to them is conflict. Isn’t it? Thought ‘striking against’ the unwanted memory. So a non-action is called for? Was K referring to a necessary “new instrument” other than thought for this situation? Isn’t this new instrument a choice less awareness of the memories? A “caring” for them? An observing of them that lets them come and go? As well as any reaction to them? The ‘whole’ event? So that there is no “duality” present in the mind? Is that the process of emptying the mind in the moment?

If one sees that and keeps escaping from it every time, is one serious at all or just playing with it? I’m not saying it’s right or wrong to do so, but is one serious?

Das Denken .
Die Dimension des Denkens ist begrenzt durch das Bekannte , das was wir kennen , nein ?
Welche Aufmerksamkeit wirkt im Denken , weil es ist anstrengend und kompliziert zu denken ?
What is powering thought ?
Oder gilt es ertmal zu verstehen was Denken ist ?
Was macht es jetzt ?
Ist es still und höhrt zu , oder macht es gerade viel Arbeit ?
The thinking . The dimension of thinking is limited by what is known , what we know , no ? What attention acts in thinking because it is exhausting and complicated to think ? What is powering thought ? Or is it first to understand what thinking is ? What is it doing now ? Is it quiet and listening or is it doing a lot of work right now?

For I, nothing matters more than I, which means I is serious about being better, stronger, more enlightened, etc, so I is deadly serious about I. But when I looks at the human condition and sees that being I is what’s wrong with our species, I is seriously conflicted and dismayed. What is I to do when I know that I must cease to be?

A rephrasing of the question - What is I to stop doing? I is already doing what sustains I. From I there is only comparison, so there can be coping better, more pleasure less pain and so on. Only from outside I, what is usually called ‘insight’, can there be the observation of I in action and the falseness can be seen, not as an idea or a concept, but directly, actually.
Now, from what I read of your post, there’s nothing new in my response. But like the person who has read a book on how to drive a vehicle with a standard transmission, knows the required action, but is afraid to get behind the wheel, it remains an idea, a concept.

Is this the reaction, there may be others, that I uses to convince I to stay the course? to escape the urge to find out? to escape the fear of knowing oneself? Which is just how I cons I because no matter how fast and far I runs, the urge goes with I. Isn’t this the part of your journey that you must take alone? As each of us must?

It’s very easy to dialogue ourselves into avoidance.

This is what K said. I can’t honestly say it is true, though it may be. You echo K’s words as if they were your findings.

But like the person who has read a book on how to drive a vehicle with a standard transmission, knows the required action, but is afraid to get behind the wheel, it remains an idea, a concept.

And presumably, you are behind the wheel doing what must be done.

It’s very easy to dialogue ourselves into avoidance.

And even easier to pretend we are not avoiding, that we are “serious”.