Hasn't Our Knowledge of K's Teachings Become a Burden of Sorts?

Are you certain that we’re not all believers because you’re not a believer, or might you believe things at times because it’s how we operate?

Only those who are living “right action” play out from moment to moment in their own lives know what it is, so forgive me for doubting that anyone here is living that way. Nevertheless, we can conceive of living that way because it’s not hard to believe that one can be so selfless and completely present that whatever they do is “right”, regardless of how strange, inappropriate, or wrong their behavior may seem to people full of ideas of what is right.

Most intelligent persons would agree that is the case. The tortured state of our minds is living proof. Yet we carry on trusting our opinions and conclusions (and, even as is the case with some, hurl insults at the messenger) - despite the fact that we always end up exactly where we began. There must be some kind of compartmentalization going on that allows imagination to overrule truth. Sheer madness.

Something different from what we have been doing must be done. And the singular understanding needed is that we cannot use knowledge to ascertain what that different action would be.

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Claim : Mystery is not mysterious if there is only mystery.

1)For there to be mystery there must at least be the idea of what is obvious/normal (ie. The Knower and the known) and the idea of that which is outside of this category.
2)Maybe premise 1 is enough?

Sorry, if my syllogism doesn’t cut the mustard, ask me again and I might do better.

Try again…

The striving seems to be the only thing that we do and perhaps can do. And we have done it so endlessly. And I have begun to give up on that as I see my knowledge kicking in. And in the course of this striving we compare notes. I’m not saying that’s bad; it’s just an observation.

My question is reinforced.

give me a clue : where am I mistaken, or not making sense?

If reality is not experienced as being made up of different, known and unknown, parts; one part cannot look at another and perceive it as mysterious.

Certainty is irrelevant. Only a conditioned mind would ask for certainty. There is no certainty in what is.

What is your inquiry into confusion, and finding out if one can move away from it?

Striving means making (great) efforts to achieve or obtain something. It means becoming something else, which implies time. Becoming is always the thought, the past, limited and fragmented.

So I would question, if striving is the only thing we can do. Striving, becoming something is a conditioning, which has been actively cultivated for at least the last 10’000 years when human invented agriculture to domesticate plants and animals.

Is it possible to see this conditioning as it is, and stop it?

Investigate the question without interference of the mind. Do nothing, until you have no choice but to act.

#26:

Yes, striving seems to be the only thing that the fragmented, conditioned mind (“me”) can do to tackle our problems, perhaps the only thing it can do.

“Me” is the conditioned mind. Is there anything of the human being beyond memory, thought, knowledge, time? To me, this is not the same question as asking if there is anything in “ME” that is beyond thought.

Clearly, there is something that is called attention, and something else that is called inattention. Isn’t there? Attention is not inattention and inattention is not attention, just as apples are not oranges and oranges are not apples.

Attention, to me, is the inner movement which flows outwardly to meet life, and it ACTS. This can be observed. Where attention is not acting, there is inattention. Where there is inattention, thought is the inner movement, striving and moving outwardly to meet life.

Just seeing that is action, as I see it. It is attention which reveals the conditioned mind’s repetitive limitations in relationship. It is attention which reveals that effort cannot break the chains of conditioning. The seeing, observing, perceiving of it is not thought. To me, in observing the limitations and bondage of conditioning, the futility and harm of striving is understood. That’s all. Something is now seen which was not seen. Is there any other action to take in relationship, any deliberate action based on knowledge?

I might be fooling myself but no striving can extinguish the “flame of discontent”. Suffering, questioning, observing - that’s life. Questioning arises arises spontaneously. One can repress questioning, like one can repress fear, anger, and so on.

Do you see it differently? In your understanding, is attention, observation, rooted in thought? Does attention act? We can compare notes, or not.

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Clarity ends confusion, but there’s no clarity until thought quits creating confusion.

Quite. Can thought quit creating confusion? Thought is highly conditioned. Can it stop its own conditioning?

Or is there another action that brings clarity? Action that is not corrupt by thought.

I don’t know. I know nothing about actual clarity…only clarity of thought.

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If you have a moment to spare just to observe the movement of thought, what happens? What do you notice happening?

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You have shared information which had never been available earlier to human beings. Can you now enlighten us further about the “non-striving striving” that will bring about the salvation of mankind? Or shall we have another quibble about “salvation”. Why not begin with “quibble”?

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The fault and the responsibility for my inquiry itself being mediocre is basically mine; that is the highest understanding I have about myself. Maybe the intensity is lacking. A man once said that even the stem of a banana tree can burn brightly if the fire is big enough. Where can this intensity come from? Do I even want it considering that it seems to be madness. Did not all these people who claim to “know” including K pass through this? I do not want to go into an area where the “I” doesn’t exist. Even if I do it is the “I” leading me there!

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In “an area where the “I” doesn’t exist”, I cannot go, so this fear is irrational. I can fear everything but awareness without I because I am fear of not-being.

Choiceless awareness is an area where I don’t exist; where I is the only thing missing, but not missed.

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Not “can you”, which implies authority and search for an answer/final state, knowledge. If one can do that, everyone can do it. What makes us look information and salvation from others? Can we look and investigate ourself for the insight and clarity?