Speaking Freely

Is connection or connectedness something which is required to be made by something else, or just what is when there is not that which is disconnect? And given self is the factor of disconnect, and the question is then put, can I see myself in its entirety and in doing so end it, there is then this thing of only being willing to look at it, if I am promised an end to it. That means I have to look at it without any consideration that it can end, and since self is this disconnect, and this disconnect is in turn the fact of isolation, then it is only in looking at isolation with no prospect of ending it, that I can even begin to look at things, which is why this is so very difficult.

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So - as i said - to observe the whole movement of ‘I’ - we should also observe the conscious/sub-c./un-c., as a whole. Shall we discuss this a little deeper?

When i check out from a train, my body automatically walks to my house. Because of sub-conscious mind, in which this ‘walking’ is stored as a ‘memory’ - because of repeated action(i.e. habit). But, when i planned to go to my friend’s house, which is three miles from my house - this sub-conscious mind is of no use. Because, it again drives me to my home - and making me forget my new plan - then there arise ‘sufferings’ due to waste of time - then mind becomes conscious - and i get to my friend’s house.

(See - as there is scientific discoveries - i’m distinguishing all this. If not, we can see the whole movement of ‘I’ without separating by scientifically found ‘types’.)

Unconscious is a stage in which the brain is not at all conscuious of the feelings (i.e. pain,etc…). So, if i’m not conscious, the un-conscious mind(which is of feelings) might take control of my mind. When my boss scolds me - there is an immediate reaction in form of ‘anger’,etc… - it’s because the conscious, is not conscious, and so it(conscious mind) is taken control of un-conscious mind(in scientific terms).

So, from this - we ‘observe’ that when the mind is not full of conscious, the sub-c. & un-c. brings only sufferings/pain/etc…

The complication is what the conditioned mind is doing, thinking, with knowledge. Then we look to work it out within the conditioned mind. Isn’t this obvious?

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‘Looking’ & ‘working it out’ are two different actions. To ‘work it out’ the conditioned mind - creates another condition - yes it’s obvious.

But to ‘look/observe’ the conditioned mind - we don’t use another conditioned mind to look it. If we use another, then it is fragmented - then there is of no use, only further complications.

But if we ‘observe’ the whole movement of ‘I’ (the conditioned mind) - there is no immediate response to find a solution and work it out. Just ‘observation’.

sounds like you are saying that we can choose “freedom from the known”

choose??? :smile:

If I decide that I want to observe (free from the conditioned mind) rather than see things as I usually do - can I do it?

No - Decision is another illusion. Decision is like - “there is some suffering inside me - I decide now to observe”, then ‘sufferings/pain/etc…’ goes on. If “House is on fire” - will we decide to pour water?

Just ‘observation’ as K said ‘watching a tree - without describing or deciding or avoiding’.

Why does the describing and deciding dissapear?

When we watch “Avenger” Movie - we just observe it’s beauty second by second - right?

Until the movie ends, there only “observation” remains.

Likewise, when we observe the tree - we can just see the beauty of it without describing/deciding it. If we start to describe it (i.e. memory as ‘I’ spring up) as “Big/small/etc…” - the very second we are getting distracted.

When we observe the ‘I’ - we can get into the root of it. But when we stop observe and describing/deciding, we cannot see the whole movement of ‘I’.

So describing/deciding/etc… not disappears - it does not appears at all in ‘observation’

Obviously not. Litterature, visual art, theater, music, language etc are dependant on shared cultural knowledge - the screenwriters, directors etc know exactly what you are going to feel and think during each moment of the narrative.

When it’s seen that the movement of life is like a swift flowing river, and ‘describing’, ‘deciding’ is like an eddy circling round itself along the bank?

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Yes. All are dependent on it. I don’t question it.

But when we go to a theatre - for that two hours - we don’t think. We just ‘observe’ the movie. It’s beauty. Only after the end of movie, we compare it, describe it scene by scene,etc…,etc…

But those two hours - only ‘observation’

Likewise there is a beauty in tree/etc… If we stop ‘observing’ - it means we are caught in the past(i.e. memories).

No judgement? For example, are we not aware of injustice, are we not wanting the good guys to win?

That justice is not cultivated while watching the movie. It was before watching the movie - we are conditioned as such - by watching trailers/other movies/etc…

On those two hours - we only ‘observe’ (I used especially avengers movie and not others)

Are you being serious/honest?
Why bother going to the movie then? You might have well have just observed a tree. - You went for an experience, and you did experience the whole gamut of self (fear, hope, injustice, joy, relief etc)

Yes I’m being Honest. I just show to you what happens during ‘observation’.

There is no ‘want’ for me to watch movies/picnic/friends/etc… and I don’t say “I won’t come to movie” to my relatives/friends/etc “when they ask me to join them”… Because there is no good/bad from want/don’t want.

I suffered for years due to pain (of a girl) and pleasure (from masturbation).

Only by sitting with K(while he inquires in videos) - a year back - I observe what happens in the world & in me.

Are you saying that watching a movie is a moment of meditation (choiceless awareness) for everybody - or just for certain people, like yourself?

:grin: :grin:

No no no - ‘desire to watch’ is the problem. These ‘desires to watch’ arises to have a ‘pleasure’ for that two hours and be relieved from our day to day ‘sufferings’ for a while.

Watching by ‘want’ is the problem

For a guy like K - there is no want/dont want. If someone compels him to go to a movie - he goes, just sit silent, without expressing anything and only ‘observing’. But the friends won’t call him next time - as they get bored with this guy as he doesn’t express pleasure/pain.

But if he called to have sex - he restricts it because it reduces the energy of body (like killing the body just for pleasure of ‘me’ or ‘other’)

Are you saying that we should be insensitive, but at the same time ruled by fear ?