Yes, we can imagine a ‘God’ creator more or less in our image and then petition ‘him’ (prayer) to give us what we want! This a belief that continues to this day and though it seems absurd, it is surrounded by a aura of ‘sanctity’.
What does it mean to solve a problem? Is it different from believing I’ve solved the problem?
do I need to feel safe? To be safe? Is safety a mirage?
Krishnamurti said the the brain must have complete security. I still don’t know what he meant by this.
If we’re sensitive, we have a better sense of how safe we may or may not be, whereas the less sensitive person has to believe they’re safe even when they are not. Take driving an automobile, for instance. It’s very unsafe when a driver is distracted by their thoughts, their conversation, music, etc., while casually, mindlessly assuming they are safe.
Just as we can imagine myself, my image of myself.
Yes, although mirage implies that there is something that the illusion is mimicking that exists independantly of me.
This is kinda more twisted than a simple mirage. There is only projection, both the subject the object, the relation between the two, and the reaction engendered.
I am on a roller coaster of my own making. There is nothing apart from the projection. There is no such thing as safety apart from me. I am a construct of fear.
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The fallacy of seeking safety within the tribe led to nationalities that actually compromise safety.
The fallacy of finding security in a higher power led to beliefs that likewise compromise that security.
Can’t we humans psychologically deal with insecurity and uncertainty?
Do we not want to accept that insecurity and uncertainty are part of life?
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Right. The problem is not the conditioning, that’s just how the brain works. The problem is our dependency on the self image and tendency to take the image (map) for the actuality (territory).
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We cannot “deal” with insecurity and certainty if (as Krishnamurti said) the brain must have “complete security”.
When the brain is quiet, free of its illusion of self, it is in contact with intelligence, compassion, love, Krishnamurti tells us. If this is true, when the brain is free of its illusory self, it is not limited by insecurity and uncertainty.
Oh man, Can you only repeat what someone else said?
So the self-image affords the brain a false sense of security and a false sense that it is relatively secure. Self ‘improvement’ techniques increase the sense of security and certainty but it is all ultimately doomed to fail because the foundation it is all built upon…is illusory.
So ‘letting go’ of the self image it has formed of itself is for the brain a descent into insecurity and uncertainty? But is that so? Or just a conclusion , a powerful fear resulting from its false conditioning?
No. The brain doesn’t “let go” of its illusory self - it sees it for what it is, and that’s the end of it. As K said, “the seeing is the doing”.
We’re here to talk about K’s teaching. Would you prefer we talk about your teaching, your opinions, your interpretation of K’s teaching?
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Talking about is still not living the teaching.
it’s more putting his words 'repeating the truth is a lie" into practice.
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In the Christian religion preaching the correct dogma correctly, opens the doors of wellbeing to all that accept it. (extra points to the preacher of righteousness - although there is still some debate about who’s preaching the correct dogma)
In this space, the exploration of dependence on this experience, what is it that earns you bonus points?
Another way of asking this question would be : why does my inability to scratch an itch, feel like Armageddon?
If you are dreaming, and you know you are dreaming, and you choose to remain in the dream (rather than waking from it), are you free from the dream?
Isn’t ‘living the teaching’ putting his insights into practice? I.e. still an imitation.
If the motivation is ‘living the teaching’, it is indeed imitation.
But what if one lives it without motivation, without purpose?
Why do you “choose” to remain in the dream? and in what way is it a choice? What is a dream - and what determines what is experienced there?
Yes - when we try to live the teaching, this is obviously a form of confusion based on a desire for accumulation.
Honest curiosity about our human experience, and understanding the need to transcend the mechanics of suffering could also be living the teachings.
When I hear ‘teachings’ my internal Warning: Authoritarianism Ahoy! red flag goes up. In that sense, living the teachings sounds a lot to me like following the Word of the Master. Krishnamurti didn’t think of himself as a teacher, right?
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A brain that is silent and empty can’t be ‘living some teaching’, can it? He was very clear about the destructive nature of the teacher / disciple relationship….and any ‘following’ in this realm.
Even the most beautiful picture of food will never satisfy one’s hunger.
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