Do we have a global brain?

Kinfonet Discussion
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I am presenting what would seem like a simple fact about the human experience.
If it is a simple fact, it should be obvious to anyone able to observe their behaviour in relation to information.

Put simply : When we are confronted with some data (for example : thought can/cannot be aware of itself - or better yet : it is thought that becomes aware vs it is God or the universe that becomes aware) what happens?
Is there transformation? Or the continuation of the habitual processes of the known? eg. belief/disbelief, conclusion, reification and confirmation of experience etc?

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Doesn’t it depend on what you mean by this " transformation" ? Is it related to opinion to? Or?..

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Transformation (on kinfonet) can be defined as no longer being under the complete authority of the known.
I think we can safely say that K proposes that this occurs when we are forced to see what the processes of the self, and their implications really are.

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So, this processess of the self… what is the nature of them? Are they real, or a theory?

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Well the theory (which is all that we are able to present using words/language) is that the self is a process of continual struggle towards progress and security, its based on fear/suffering - conditioned by millions of years of evolution, starting with our ancestors that survived thanks to reactions based on good & bad. (eg. food & danger)

Everything seems to indicate that this process is really taking place, that the theory is sound - but of course, hearing the words is not sufficient for transformation.

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It seems so… And it seems that K. was talking of these things. What is real and what is our experience at work

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I think you are asking : what is our situation in this moment? are we seeing clearly (awakened, free from fear) or are we experiencing a reality conditioned by the known, by fear?

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Am I asking?.. Well I must be… this question about what is actually happening about everybody of us, and it seems this is a very important thing, a question K. also put to everybody

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The amazing thing is : if we look honestly, with genuine curiosity at this moment - in other words - if we allow for fearless awareness - then in that moment fear is not present.

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I’m sorry if I can’t always make myself clear. My command of English is not good. I do not mind being correced by anybody.

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No worries @Valer - we are all humans here - lets use a bit of silence : lets both shut up, give ourselves a few moments of calm, and look at what we are experiencing now. Talk to you later.

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So what is it that is aware of thought if not thought itself? Can thought be aware of itself without any interference from an observer? That’s the full question. When a question is complete there is really no need for an answer.

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It seems that only real perception is able to clear this question, and any speculation is only an impediment to this.

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When you talk of real perception you are then creating your own obstacles. It is as much of an illusion as the observer or the seeker after truth. When the brain is only a question what happens?

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Why do you say ''after the truth"? I myself did not mean “after”, but with the fact, when it takes it’s place.

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Alright, when is when? If it is not now then it will never be, will it? So the truth is now. And where are we now? Are we globally together or are we in two or more separate places?

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It is now, no question about this.
But I need to understand better, what do you mean by being “globally together”.

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Geographically we are in two separate places. That’s a simple, observable fact. Psychologically, are we also in two separate places? That’s not so easy to determine. But when we both say, ‘I don’t know where we are or what I am,’ then a great deal of the distance between us has already disappeared. So far over the course of this dialogue we have also seen that we are thought and very little else, maybe even nothing else. If this is clear then we may be able to work together.

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It looks like it is so, and I can agree to this. I can even try to put it in other words: if both of us are at the same level, so to say, when there’s no interference from our past experiences, no judgement, no opinions, it is then much, much easier to grasp the point and significance of what we are discussing.

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The organism.

There is a tendency to throw out this term ‘awareness’ as though it exists as something totally separate from thought, as almost a magical property of consciousness.

All we know about awareness is that everything living is aware, whether it has a brain or not. So awareness is “magical” until science can explain what it is. David Bohm speculated that awareness may be beyond the brain. Krishnamurti talked about how awareness is choiceless, like breathing or heart-beat.

Every careful or careless explanation has been constructed by thought. The words ‘me’ and ‘you’ are the work of thought; so you and I are ourselves thought.

That’s quite a leap. Are you everything you have created, including your thought created image of yourself? Or are you a confused and conflicted brain trying desperately to explain away your confusion and conflict?

Usually, if we are honest with ourselves and careful enough to observe, there is awareness of what thought is doing only after the fact.

Psychological thought reacts to choiceless awareness, so if one is “careful enough to observe”, there is awareness before there is the conditioned brain’s reaction to it.

It is this observer or separate self who then talks of being choicelessly aware as a way out of its own conditioning.

And is it working? Of course not, so only an idiot or a hopelessly dishonest brain would persist in such self-deception. We are all choicelessly aware for the one or two seconds it takes our conditioning to react to it. Awareness is choiceless, in an of itself, and the brain with psychological content is in conflict with it.

Your dishonesty is diabolical because you’re not aware of your conditioned response to awareness. All you’re interested in is your false identity and whatever crafty elaborate BS you can pollute this forum with to sustain it.

I am glad you are fighting back because each time we talk we are able to get a little deeper into it and we can then clear out some of the confusing language. Not many people stick so ruthlessly to pursuing this kind of question.

You’re so full of shit I’m ashamed to be communicating with you.